oh jeez, haha, right in the title

I'm old

Was this a response to something in the OP that I am not seeing?

Supposedly Trilly Donovan said OSU is in a decent spot with Easter after his visit. I don't know that it was phrased as strongly as "trending to the Buckeyes."

Teams don't like to clog the paint in modern offenses.

I think with Purdue there is just a lot of confidence in Painter to keep the boiler train chugging along, even with no Edey in the furnace, and Painter has probably earned that confidence at this point. They are the most consistent program in the B1G right now and have been so for about the past decade.

It's kind of the reverse situation for OSU with Diebler being close to a complete unknown as a HC and program-runner. I think that's where you are seeing the "unanimity" of having the Buckeyes falling into the middle range in the conference. One, it's a big-ass conference with a lot of potential Tournament teams, but, two, most voters are basically splitting the difference between what looks like a pretty good roster on paper (but not super proven in several areas, particularly shooting and the frontcourt) and the unknown of how all these disparate pieces will gel together under a brand new HC who hasn't been a HC for a whole season before.

There is no B1G team that I think is on a different higher tier from the rest of the conference, so I honestly could see OSU finishing as high as 1st. But I also could see OSU finishing as low as 12th (bear in mind that 12th isn't even bottom third in the B1G any more). The conference is almost too big to even think about properly, let's be real. There are some B1G teams where I feel like the range of variance is still somewhat wide but maybe restricted to top half of the conference (like Purdue, Indiana, Illinois, UCLA), some B1G teams that are on the negative side of that equation (like Minnesota and Penn State), and quite a few teams where I truly have no clue how things are going to pan out for them this season (USC, Nebraska, Northwestern, scUM, Wisconsin, Rutgers).

The thing with Rutgers is, yeah, they bring in Dylan Harper and Ace Bailey, but the rest of that roster is such a hodge-podge, with a lot of the best talent on it being true freshmen (but most of those frosh probably not ready to make big impacts besides Harper and Bailey). It's not like they're devoid of other pieces, but I would kind of liken it to EJ's last year at OSU where he and Malaki had to do so much for that team just to earn them a 7-seed. Yeah, Malaki turned out to be a one-and-done super frosh, but EJ was a junior. What does it look like for Rutgers to rely a ton on two freshmen? And I don't know if that team will have the same typical Pikiell identity where every game is a defensive muck-fest; I would think they're gonna try to let things flow a bit more so their star frosh can show out. So they're going to be more fun to play against, I think, but hard to say what things are gonna look like for the Scarlet Knights in the W/L column at the end of the season. They have some returning (Williams, Davis) and transfer (Derkack, Acuff) guards that might be able to step up and flesh out their backcourt rotation with Harper into a real strength, but the frontcourt situation is looking very dubious beside Bailey. All of their forwards and bigs are freshmen other than Zach Martini from Princeton (averaged about 8 & 3 last season) and Emmanuel Ogbole (2 & 2).

To be clear, though, a lot of next season's B1G teams are like this: potential, but question marks all over the place. If Harper and Bailey are all they're cracked up to be and if some other things click just right for Rutgers, then sure, they could be a Top 4 team in the conference.

I'm not trying to say they're super similar, and I agree that Liddell is a better athlete, but just saying in terms of a recent OSU player, I think the plan is for Royal to have a similar role to what Liddell had here, but maybe (hopefully) won't be relied on as heavily as we sometimes did on Liddell for scoring or, like, being the whole force of our frontcourt (especially whenever Kyle was dealing with one of his 14 concussions).

My larger point is that I don't think Royal is going to play much at the 3 here. He's going to be a 4 for us, and some people will say he is too short for that--but, like EJ, Devin has skill and length and strength that can create mismatch opportunities for him at his size but also allow him to hold his own on the defensive end as long as he isn't guarding guys that are too quick for him.

Liddell was not a good 3P shooter as a frosh (19%). The biggest thing for Royal will be whether he can develop his outside shot the way EJ did here. JJ Sullinger said on X that Royal was torching the nets in practice the other day. Let's hope some of that translates into games, Royal becomes so much more dangerous offensively once he becomes a threat to hit shots from the perimeter.

I have to echo Wig here, I'd be pretty surprised if Parrish doesn't start. 

Parrish is a better fit for a starting 3 for an up-tempo team than anyone else on the roster, and he has far more real game experience than any of our other guys that are forwards or bigs. He's kind of the balancing point between our veteran backcourt (third-year starter Bruce Thornton, 5th year Meechie Johnson, and 5th year Ques Glover) and our inexperienced frontcourt (sophomores Royal, Bradshaw, and Stewart -- none of whom averaged more than 14mpg last season). Parrish is a 5th year guy who never played less than 21 mpg a season and averages 28 mpg a season on his career. He is a more fluid ballhandler and natural wing player than a guy like Royal, and a more versatile scorer than Mahaffey. Parrish is also far better suited for defending on the wing in a man defense than Royal is.

Diebler had some pretty candid remarks about Royal getting a little too far away from his bread-and-butter (offensive rebounding, cutting, being a force around the basket) this summer. That tells me that while, sure, they want Devin to expand his game, I do think the vision is more for Royal to be that Liddell-esque 4 (and hopefully his outside shot will develop similarly). I think Stewart will be splitting his time between the 4 and the 5, so regardless of who actually starts at the 4, I do think Royal will be playing starter-type minutes at the 4.

UConn is very much in it for Bundalo, too.

When you say "we need at least 2 guards in the '25 class," are you including Dorian Jones as one of those 2?

I don't think we are adding 2 more guards in the class. At the moment, feels like our best chance is 1 of Easter, Denis, or Hannah. I don't see 2 of those guys going to the same school. Peterson would have been slightly different since he is almost certainly one-and-done, maybe you get a T50ish CG to agree to come in with him. But yeah, outside of that unlikely scenario, I'd say OSU is only adding 1 more HS guard in the 2025 class.

Add a forward like Bynum or Bundalo and we are probably done in terms of HS recruiting for 2025 with a nice 3-man class. Then take however many and whatever kind of transfers you need to take in the spring (which will depend largely on who we are losing, which right now we don't know for sure aside from Meechie, Micah, and Ques).

I agree with your "done heard that before" remark about the supposed depth... BUT, for Diebler to play this team at the pace he wants, he almost has to develop a certain level of functional depth, regardless of whether guys 8-10 are half as good as guys 1-7. 

When Diebler says that right now he thinks he has "a starting 7 or 8," pretty sure he is talking about Thornton, Johnson, Glover, Parrish, Royal, Stewart, and Bradshaw (with Mahaffey being the "or 8"). To maintain the kind of intensity and tempo Diebs is looking for, he needs to find 2-3 more guys he can include in the rotation mix, even if just for 5-10 minutes per game or so. I'm thinking those "support tier" guys will be Mahaffey, Mobley, and maybe Njegovan. 

I think we are going to start Stewart and Bradshaw as the frontcourt, but I think a lot of times when Bradshaw comes out, we are going to slide Stewart over to the post and play Royal or Mahaffey at the 4. Mahaffey will also probably be the primary back-up at the 3 behind Parrish, so I could see Mahaffey still getting something like 15 mpg while Royal might play over half of the available minutes at the 4 spot.

Foul trouble and various situations will probably necessitate occasional minutes from one other big. Parks is more physical and slightly more experienced in terms of the U.S. college basketball setting, but Njegovan seems to have the higher upside. Both Diebler and Justus, our associate head coach, seem fairly high on Njegovan's shooting touch and overall potential, and I know shooting has been a big point of emphasis this summer (as it needed to be), so I am somewhat expecting Njegovan to push Parks down to the farthest end of the bench (where Etzler has been hanging out until he graduates).

There have been a lot of positive comments about Colin White's physicality and approach this summer, but short of injury issues or something like that, I just can't see how he gets regular minutes this season. Even if, say, Mobley doesn't play much, I don't think that opens up much of anything for White, he's still most likely behind both Parrish & Mahaffey at SF and Stewart, Royal, & Mahaffey at PF.  I think Diebs will try to get White minutes wherever he can because I do think they really like White, but I don't see him playing much in the close games this season.

Not sure why you are getting downvoted, it has been abundantly clear that a lot of this fanbase doesn't know how to set proper expectations for the basketball program. And that's not trying to make any sort of excuse for Holtmann's performance or anything like that, but as soon as Diebler has lost a couple games there will be plenty of posters on here and other OSU boards questioning the hire. And if it's guys who were already questioning the hire, they'll be playing "told you so."

My understanding is that UNC is Bundalo's dream school. And he just visited them on 10/4.

I know he canceled his upcoming visit to UK, so that's good, but right now I am thinking UNC or UConn for Bundalo. But is OSU prioritizing him more than those schools? Do we have a better sell in terms of need and immediate PT? How much does he care about playing college close to home? Who is offering the most NIL? Yeah, I don't know, I suppose somewhere in the mix of all those factors, OSU has a chance.

It's just really hard for me to account for Chatman. I don't know if I should think of him as a future starting guard at OSU, though I have no doubt he'd eventually get that kind of role somewhere as long as he is in a situation where he stays healthy and is getting a good amount of PT.

Mobley and Johnson are a nice combo but would love to get a bigger guard in here like Easter or Denis who can wear both backcourt hats.

or Isaiah Denis. that'd be fine, too.

Never gave us much of a chance with Peterson.

Let's get Jerry Easter, though. A big combo lead guard playmaker that could be here for a couple years sounds like a great way to transition out of the Bruce Thornton era and would, I think, help build a strong backcourt foundation for Diebler's future as a coach.

Easter would be an ideal addition given his all-around game as a guard. Dorian Jones is purely a wing and both Johnson and Glover will be gone after this season (and possibly Thornton). Who knows what will happen with Chatman. So, yeah, while we could re-stock on backcourt players through the portal, I'd love to add a guy like Easter who can play well on or off the ball and is a good ballhandler, facilitator, and playmaker. I think him and Mobley could be great complements to each other for a year or two.

Peterson or Bundalo would also be fantastic, but I am not going to hold my breath on either. I think OSU has a shot with both, it just feels like the kind of recruitments with those two where so many factors come into play that might end up having OSU falling just short.

Yeah, I think in general it's just hard to project these days because of how different almost every team is, season to season.

One thing that helps the AP poll voting is you do have that larger pool to select the most talented  teams or veteran teams or what have you.

With the B1G this season I think it is a pretty big muddle, though a lot of the voters seems to think Purdue isn't going to miss a beat.

Picked to finish 8th in the B1G. Which, hey, in an 18-team power conference, that's above average. I've seen some of our fans think that the 8th place pick is disrespectful to the team's potential. Which: yeah, I get that. But, mind you, this is a ranking, not a comment on OSU's quality by itself. To know how they think OSU should rank in the B1G, the media member also should be figuring out how all the other B1G teams rank. And, honestly, I don't envy any of them trying to do that with a huge conference like this and with so many teams fielding pretty new rosters that look, at least on the surface, to be of decent quality.

Huge conference, bunch of teams will be pretty different from last season, etc. I'm not surprised we are picked 8th, as I think you could make an argument for any of the teams ahead of us to be ahead of us, but you could also make an argument for OSU to be ahead many of them. Thing is, you could also make an argument for a few of the teams behind us to be ahead of us. No one really knows how this is going to turn out. Like, I get why Purdue is getting picked to win the conference, but even with them you are talking about a program that was kind of built around Zach Edey the past two seasons, and now they have a Zach Edey-sized hole. So who knows how good they're even gonna be?

Talent-wise I think OSU stacks up pretty well, on paper, but time will tell what the actual team chemistry looks like and what the strengths and deficiencies will be of the line-ups we throw out there. I think the media voters are probably playing it a bit safe in terms of this being Diebler's first year as a HC, which makes sense.

Anyways, in this big-ass iteration of the B1G, finishing 8th probably has us safely in the Dance, so I wouldn't be mad about 8th place this season.

Yeah, there's always going to be an element of the unknown. Even when hiring a really proven coach, putting them into a new school and new program dynamic -- not to mention the constant changing trends in the sport itself -- means there are no guarantees of success, no matter who you hire.

As Bsk33 noted above, OSU/Bjork were pretty smart with how they structured Diebler's contract. They made a significant commitment to him, but they didn't tie themselves down into a situation where they'd have no choice but to keep him on for 5 years or whatever. If he proves himself these first couple years, then he gets that more secure extension.

Despite my tempered enthusiasm, I'm still pretty curious to see how this thing goes. Everything we know about Diebler tells us that pace and tempo and transition points are going to be a high point of emphasis, and I can't really remember the last time that was the case for OSU basketball. It could be fun to watch, or it could lead to more of my two least favorite things: turnovers and bad shot selection.

Yeah, I am hoping that once the season starts, I will naturally get more into it.

Yeah, I hear a lot of that and agree on most of it.

If I think about it clearly, my personal struggles this summer probably have a lot to do with how I am feeling now. Back in the late spring/early summer (feels like a year ago to me, tbh) I was plenty invested in wondering what transfers Diebler was going to get onto the roster.

Sometimes, when life gets hard, it depletes a lot of your energy tanks. Including the one marked "sports fandom," I guess.

We seem to have an echo in here.

What qualifies as a "meltdown"?

I understand that Holtmann had some really brutal stretches in conference play. But basketball teams do tend to lose more in conference play if they play in a major conference. 

Absolutely, I hope we avoid the long losing streaks or really bad months that we saw regularly under Holtmann. But does a .500 month in conference play count as a "meltdown," too? I am not sure Diebler will be immune to those. Hopefully, though, we do finish above .500 in the B1G next season (something we haven't done the past two seasons).

Yeah, maybe I need some sort of "sports fan rejuvenation" therapy, haha.

Yeah, I didn't mention that, but the new B1G is definitely a weird paradigm. I used to care a lot about the conference race, now I'm just like, "eh, that's a lot of teams, huh."

I do think it stinks that we have so few weekend conference games this season. Our best non-con home game is, uh, Pitt. Not doing the ticket sales many favors this year, yet again. I wonder if fans will turn out to support Diebler more than they did at the tail-end of Holtmann's regime, but I dunno. I kind of wonder if it won't look much different, and it would need to look a lot different to look good.